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Author: Subject: Living Wage Pizza Bombing in the Marketplace

Zen Peach





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  posted on 8/28/2015 at 10:55 PM
Locals applaud pizza shop owner for significantly raising his pay scale, but aren't lining up to buy $30 pizzas.....

http://muskegonpundit.blogspot.com/2015/08/california-pizza-shop-tries-to-s ell.html

 
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Universal Peach



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  posted on 8/29/2015 at 11:25 AM
quote:
Locals applaud pizza shop owner for significantly raising his pay scale, but aren't lining up to buy $30 pizzas.....

http://muskegonpundit.blogspot.com/2015/08/california-pizza-shop-tries-to-s ell.html

_________________________________________________________________________

Wait, the liberals said raising the minimum wage would spur economic activity and bring in more revenue.

 

Zen Peach



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  posted on 8/29/2015 at 01:18 PM
The minimum wage wasn't raised in the area, just by this one store.............

This guy did it on his own, just for his employees...... for this to work, the other people in the community also need the wage hike, so they have the additional money to spend on things........ but you knew that.... great example!



[Edited on 8/29/2015 by Sang]

 

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Universal Peach



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  posted on 8/29/2015 at 01:26 PM
quote:
The minimum wage wasn't raised in the area, just by this one store.............

This guy did it on his own, just for his employees...... for this to work, the other people in the community also need the wage hike, so they have the additional money to spend on things........ but you knew that.... great example!
_________________________________________________________________________

When the liberals said raising the minimum wage would spur economic activity and bring in more revenue they didn’t mention your excuse why it isn’t working.

Excuses don’t help people.




 

Zen Peach



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  posted on 8/29/2015 at 03:33 PM
quote:
The minimum wage wasn't raised in the area, just by this one store.............

This guy did it on his own, just for his employees...... for this to work, the other people in the community also need the wage hike, so they have the additional money to spend on things........ but you knew that.... great example!


Great idea. The business model is failing and the owner is worried about shutting down, so take
failure and spread it around to other businesses as well? What about folks on fixed income, when a gallon of milk runs you $10? How is this fair to them?

The ironic part of the story is the store owner wasn't trying to make some kind of statement. He really believed folks that had been imploring businesses to pay a "living wage" would support his business for doing so. They haven't. These ideas always good in theory, but not so much in the real world.

This is example A-1 why wages are not set on what it costs people to live.

 

Universal Peach



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  posted on 8/29/2015 at 03:36 PM
This populist political issue the liberals are pushing is blowing up in the faces of real people.

Surprise! Leftist minimum wage policy backfires in Seattle suburb
http://www.unitedliberty.org/articles/17751-warning-to-seattle-seatac-busin esses-slashing-benefits-overtime-in-wake-of-wage-hike


We Are Seeing The Effects Of Seattle's $15 An Hour Minimum Wage
http://www.forbes.com/sites/timworstall/2015/03/16/we-are-seeing-the-effect s-of-seattles-15-an-hour-minimum-wage/


Seattle’s Minimum Wage Hike Causing Major Problems

http://yournation.org/seattles-minimum-wage-hike-causing-major-problems/


 

Extreme Peach



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  posted on 8/29/2015 at 03:37 PM
quote:
quote:
The minimum wage wasn't raised in the area, just by this one store.............

This guy did it on his own, just for his employees...... for this to work, the other people in the community also need the wage hike, so they have the additional money to spend on things........ but you knew that.... great example!
_________________________________________________________________________

When the liberals said raising the minimum wage would spur economic activity and bring in more revenue they didn’t mention your excuse why it isn’t working.

Excuses don’t help people.



Are you able to make a comment about economics without using words like liberal and low info?

You know bigotry is both borne of stupidity and perpetuates it. You need to read the article and you would see the narrative is being supplied by a right wing zealot like yourself and not a liberal.

Obviously, as Sang mentioned, community wages need to rise so people can purchase more expensive items.

But there have always been cases where entrepreneurs repackage items like burgers and pizzas and sell them at prices way higher than the market standard. It works in many cases. It doesn't in others but the determinant will be the market.

In this case the pizza shop owner decided to implement a social business model and be a market leader in improving the lot of low income workers. It’s generally understood that these models take time to spill over on the business end. A probable immediate benefit is staff loyalty which would result in better quality of product and service. Customers in this sense would realize the difference in quality and then decide if they want to pay for it. Pizza customers are not that discriminating and so this may be a tough market to demonstrate this benefit at first.

This case does fit a capitalist model where entrepreneurs try to identify different market niches to compete.

 

Zen Peach



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  posted on 8/29/2015 at 03:43 PM
quote:
This populist political issue the liberals are pushing is blowing up in the faces of real people.



As per usual. Seems as if there is a failure to think things through. The failure to grasp basic laws of economics is staggering.

 

Universal Peach



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  posted on 8/29/2015 at 03:45 PM
quote:
quote:
quote:
The minimum wage wasn't raised in the area, just by this one store.............

This guy did it on his own, just for his employees...... for this to work, the other people in the community also need the wage hike, so they have the additional money to spend on things........ but you knew that.... great example!
_________________________________________________________________________

When the liberals said raising the minimum wage would spur economic activity and bring in more revenue they didn’t mention your excuse why it isn’t working.

Excuses don’t help people.



Are you able to make a comment about economics without using words like liberal and low info?

You know bigotry is both borne of stupidity and perpetuates it. You need to read the article and you would see the narrative is being supplied by a right wing zealot like yourself and not a liberal.

Obviously, as Sang mentioned, community wages need to rise so people can purchase more expensive items.

But there have always been cases where entrepreneurs repackage items like burgers and pizzas and sell them at prices way higher than the market standard. It works in many cases. It doesn't in others but the determinant will be the market.

In this case the pizza shop owner decided to implement a social business model and be a market leader in improving the lot of low income workers. It’s generally understood that these models take time to spill over on the business end. A probable immediate benefit is staff loyalty which would result in better quality of product and service. Customers in this sense would realize the difference in quality and then decide if they want to pay for it. Pizza customers are not that discriminating and so this may be a tough market to demonstrate this benefit at first.

This case does fit a capitalist model where entrepreneurs try to identify different market niches to compete.

______________________________________________________________________

Well the experts say, supported by local media that this populist political is not working.

If the SEIU militants, backed by George Soros, pressing the matter want more money they should get a real education and a real job.
It is a matter of personal responsibility.




 

Extreme Peach



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  posted on 8/29/2015 at 03:48 PM
quote:

Great idea. The business model is failing and the owner is worried about shutting down, so take
failure and spread it around to other businesses as well? What about folks on fixed income, when a gallon of milk runs you $10? How is this fair to them?



Economics is way to complicated a field for you as well. How is this failure being spread around? You need to find real cases that have something to do with what you are trying to critique. You are speculating on events that have yet to happen and blaming everything on a case of independent entrepreneurship.

 

Peach Extraordinaire



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  posted on 8/29/2015 at 04:13 PM
quote:
quote:
quote:
The minimum wage wasn't raised in the area, just by this one store.............

This guy did it on his own, just for his employees...... for this to work, the other people in the community also need the wage hike, so they have the additional money to spend on things........ but you knew that.... great example!
_________________________________________________________________________

When the liberals said raising the minimum wage would spur economic activity and bring in more revenue they didn’t mention your excuse why it isn’t working.

Excuses don’t help people.



Are you able to make a comment about economics without using words like liberal and low info?

You know bigotry is both borne of stupidity and perpetuates it. You need to read the article and you would see the narrative is being supplied by a right wing zealot like yourself and not a liberal.

Obviously, as Sang mentioned, community wages need to rise so people can purchase more expensive items.

But there have always been cases where entrepreneurs repackage items like burgers and pizzas and sell them at prices way higher than the market standard. It works in many cases. It doesn't in others but the determinant will be the market.

In this case the pizza shop owner decided to implement a social business model and be a market leader in improving the lot of low income workers. It’s generally understood that these models take time to spill over on the business end. A probable immediate benefit is staff loyalty which would result in better quality of product and service. Customers in this sense would realize the difference in quality and then decide if they want to pay for it. Pizza customers are not that discriminating and so this may be a tough market to demonstrate this benefit at first.

This case does fit a capitalist model where entrepreneurs try to identify different market niches to compete.


Great post. I enjoyed reading that. It was stated well and shows a real fundamental understanding of a macro view on this issue, as opposed to the usual culprits who do drive by criticisms.

 

Zen Peach



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  posted on 8/29/2015 at 04:16 PM
quote:

for this to work, the other people in the community also need the wage hike, so they have the additional money to spend on things........ great example!




That's just classic inflation and devalued currency.

 

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Peach Extraordinaire



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  posted on 8/29/2015 at 04:17 PM
So this example and an unconfirmed quote of, "This movement, it’s going on everywhere” would represent a valid case study in microeconomics that proves wage increases of this nature will not work in the long term? Any respected economist only accepts cause & effect based upon preponderance of evidence.

Interesting in that the article from the blog cited has a picture and quote from Ayn Rand. That explains about all one needs to know.

 

Zen Peach



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  posted on 8/29/2015 at 04:27 PM
quote:
quote:
This populist political issue the liberals are pushing is blowing up in the faces of real people.



As per usual. Seems as if there is a failure to think things through. The failure to grasp basic laws of economics is staggering.



As you and mule have done a great job proving............

 

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Universal Peach



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  posted on 8/29/2015 at 04:57 PM
quote:
quote:

Great idea. The business model is failing and the owner is worried about shutting down, so take
failure and spread it around to other businesses as well? What about folks on fixed income, when a gallon of milk runs you $10? How is this fair to them?



Economics is way to complicated a field for you as well. How is this failure being spread around? You need to find real cases that have something to do with what you are trying to critique. You are speculating on events that have yet to happen and blaming everything on a case of independent entrepreneurship.

___________________________________________________________________

Already posted:

Surprise! Leftist minimum wage policy backfires in Seattle suburb
http://www.unitedliberty.org/articles/17751-warning-to-seattle-seatac-busin esses-slashing-benefits-overtime-in-wake-of-wage-hike


We Are Seeing The Effects Of Seattle's $15 An Hour Minimum Wage
http://www.forbes.com/sites/timworstall/2015/03/16/we-are-seeing-the-effect s-of-seattles-15-an-hour-minimum-wage/


Seattle’s Minimum Wage Hike Causing Major Problems

http://yournation.org/seattles-minimum-wage-hike-causing-major-problems/


 

Zen Peach



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  posted on 8/29/2015 at 05:40 PM
The links you provided for Forbes and UnitedLiberty don't work.

The one for yournation is 4 short paragraphs long, and doesn't list any problems that are being caused.


Try again.......

 

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Universal Peach



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  posted on 8/29/2015 at 05:59 PM
quote:
The links you provided for Forbes and UnitedLiberty don't work.

The one for yournation is 4 short paragraphs long, and doesn't list any problems that are being caused.


Try again.......

_______________________________________________________________________

The FORBES link works just fine.

http://www.forbes.com/sites/timworstall/2015/03/16/we-are-seeing-the-effect s-of-seattles-15-an-hour-minimum-wage/






[Edited on 8/29/2015 by Muleman1994]

 

Zen Peach



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  posted on 8/29/2015 at 06:06 PM
You seem to be incapable of posting a link, or even reading the articles you link.....

Tell me how the only link that works - yournation - says anything at all, let alone support your "position"?

Since you can't link, I'll post the entire article for you....

Seattle’s Minimum Wage Hike Causing Major Problems

The minimum wage in Seattle has been raised to $15 per hour. Critics are using the results of that effort as evidence that raising the minimum wage hurts the economy.

Opponents say, despite the fact more people are applying for jobs, hiring is not taking place. Instead, managers are taking more responsibilities to avoid the extra costs of hiring someone. Businesses have lain off workers or frozen the size of the workforce. Parking lots are charging more in order to cover the extra expense. Hotels are reducing benefits to employees to cover the extra cost in wages.
Seattle’s minimum wage was the result of a compromise worked out by a committee of business executives, community advocates, and union representatives. Not all employers are required to pay the minimum wage until 2025.

Such a compromise does not stop critics from saying that the overall result will be negative for the economy and for workers. They say that companies will keep more skilled workers while offering fewer jobs to less skilled workers. As a result, they claim, it will be more difficult for new workers to find jobs. The success or failure of Seattle’s new minimum wage law may have great bearing upon the national debate regarding income equality and the minimum wage.



So - explain how that article with the misleading title supports your position....

 

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World Class Peach



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  posted on 8/29/2015 at 06:07 PM
i don't know, those prices don't look too bad if you think about tipping the delivery driver or a 15-20% tip for dine in. with 5 stores they look like they are still doing ok. i'm still digging for better info about how his experiment is going.

https://lanesplitterpizza.com/#pizza-pies

http://www.yelp.com/biz/lanesplitter-pizza-and-pubs-oakland-2

http://www.yelp.com/biz/lanesplitter-pub-and-pizza-emeryville

[Edited on 8/29/2015 by LeglizHemp]

[Edited on 8/29/2015 by LeglizHemp]

 

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True Peach



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  posted on 8/29/2015 at 06:07 PM
Too much worrying and blaming for burger flippers not making $15 an hour ... not enough effort to get higher paying manufacturing jobs back. Blame whoever you want for this. Just sayin'.

 

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Ultimate Peach



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  posted on 8/29/2015 at 06:10 PM
Well lets see, the Forbes article is from March. The $11 minimum wage in Seattle went into effect on April 1. Hmm.
 

Zen Peach



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  posted on 8/29/2015 at 06:10 PM
quote:
quote:
The links you provided for Forbes and UnitedLiberty don't work.

The one for yournation is 4 short paragraphs long, and doesn't list any problems that are being caused.


Try again.......

_______________________________________________________________________

The FORBES link works just fine.

http://www.forbes.com/sites/timworstall/2015/03/16/we-are-seeing-the-effect s-of-seattles-15-an-hour-minimum-wage/

[Edited on 8/29/2015 by Muleman1994]



Again, an empty article. It was written in March, before the minimum wage was raised..... it only speculates on what 'might' happen.....

 

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World Class Peach



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  posted on 8/29/2015 at 06:28 PM
this is from 2 years ago. i think this place has more problems than high prices and living wages.

http://www.sfweekly.com/foodie/2013/04/17/lanesplitter-pizza-employees-prot est-working-conditions-with-walkout

 

____________________
Flies all green 'n buzzin' in his dungeon of despair
Who are all those people that he's locked away up there
Are they crazy?,
Are they sainted?
Are they zeros someone painted?,
It has never been explained since at first it was created

 

Universal Peach



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  posted on 8/29/2015 at 07:05 PM
Conservatives look at issues such as minimum wage from a results-oriented point of view. Does a certain law make sense and what actual results will be produced?
Liberals like President Obama take a process-based approach where “intentions” are more meaningful than the actual results.

Some liberals here, incapable of sourcing information, are more interested in supporting their failed president that looking at the actual facts and results of politically motivated laws.

 

Universal Peach



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  posted on 8/29/2015 at 07:35 PM
The term liberal has a poor connotation with many Americans so the left has adopted the term “progressives” as they are afraid of being accurately labeled socialists.

Fine, here is progressive’s view of the minimum wage issue:

The progressive case against a minimum wage increase

August 28, 2015 12:20 am • By David Nicklaus

http://www.stltoday.com/business/columns/david-nicklaus/the-progressive-cas e-against-a-minimum-wage-increase/article_1c0a4320-2b29-5ca3-a7ac-d4d1afc18 e2d.html

St. Louis nonprofits say forcing minimum wage for disabled workers could cost jobs
The pending city wage bill would include those workers, though federal law exempts them.

Nicklaus: $15 minimum wage push looks like a job killer

Cities are entering uncharted territory with their big increases

$15 minimum wage proposal faces business backlash

Employers say bill would force them to move or cut jobs

Many supporters of a higher minimum wage like to imply that their opponents are conservatives who put corporate profits above poor people’s lives.

That caricature is far from the truth. Just ask Antonio French, who has built a reputation as a progressive, even a firebrand, in six years as a St. Louis alderman. He spent many hours with Ferguson protesters last year, and he has fought the business establishment on key development issues.

French voted against the minimum-wage bill the Board of Aldermen advanced Tuesday, and he’ll oppose it again when it comes up for a second vote Friday. In a phone conversation, he described his stand as both principled and practical.

“It would have been an easy vote for me to vote yes,” French told me. “I don’t have a lot of businesses in my ward. I do have a lot of poor folks who think the minimum wage is a great idea, but I know it’s not.”

The bill would raise St. Louis’ minimum wage to $11 an hour by 2018, a 44 percent increase over the statewide minimum of $7.65.

Such a steep climb, French worries, would price many young people out of the job market.
In the city of St. Louis, the unemployment rate for 16- to 19-year-olds is 34 percent. For 20- to 24-year-olds, it’s 16 percent. Raising the minimum wage amounts to knocking out the lowest rung of a career ladder that’s already out of reach for nearly 2,400 young city residents.

French has seen the effect that an $8- or $9-an-hour job can have on young people’s lives. He fears that if the minimum goes to $11, employers will hire older, more experienced workers rather than taking a chance on a kid.

Economists refer that as labor-for-labor substitution. It’s hard to see in big-picture statistics, which may be why some studies find that raising the minimum wage doesn’t eliminate jobs in the short run.

William Wascher, a Federal Reserve Board economist, has done extensive research on the effects of minimum-wage increases. He’s convinced that they do reduce employment over time, and he’s even more certain that they harm the least-experienced workers.

“Minimum wages do more harm than good,” Wascher said. “They reduce employment opportunities for low-skilled workers, and they don’t appear to do much to reduce poverty.”
The harmful effects that show up in studies of statewide or nationwide increases will be more severe in an area as small — and with as much concentrated poverty — as the city of St. Louis.

If employers move outside the city limits to avoid the minimum wage, they’re less likely to hire the young city residents whom French is hoping to steer away from the drug trade. He says a part-time job paying $200 a week can keep a young person off the streets and probably away from prison or an early grave.

French, who has an MBA from Washington University, knows some of those $8-an-hour jobs won’t exist at $11. He respects the moral argument some of his colleagues make about a living wage, but thinks it’s out of touch with the reality he sees in the city.

“I’m just trying to put poor folks to work,” French says. “The biggest problem we have is unemployment.”

The logic is simple, even though it seems beyond the grasp of other self-styled progressives. If a policy is going to make your biggest problem worse, it’s a bad policy.





 
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