Thread: Twice deported illegal kills NFL Player

OriginalGoober - 2/6/2018 at 01:11 AM

So we send them back and they return again and again thru our porous southern border. Failed immigration policy causes another tragedy. Not only does he cause a serious crash, he flees the scene. Tell me again how they respect the rule of law please?

https://www.indystar.com/story/news/crime/2018/02/05/driver-accused-killing -colts-player-edwin-jackson-undocumented-immigrant-has-been-deported-twice/ 306779002/

BTW, nice crew-cab F150 truck for an illegal. Kind of goes against the poor produce- picking picture painted by Pelosi.



jkeller - 2/6/2018 at 01:23 AM

How many shootings have occurred in this country while Republicans offer thoughts and prayers? Why don't you ever own up to the failings of your GOP heroes?

You are what is wrong with this country.


2112 - 2/6/2018 at 02:18 AM

That's terrible. Trump needs to get on the phone with Mexico right away and have them send a check for a wall. Time for the great negotiator to get his negotiating with Mexico done!


nebish - 2/6/2018 at 02:44 AM

Crimes involving illegal aliens seem to get alot of attention, by those who want to give them attention, because the argument is that if that person wasn't here in the first place, whatever crime or event wouldn't have happened.

The other side of the coin is that any gun related attack or crime, the argument could be if the gun wasn't legal, easily obtained or didn't exist at all then that crime or event wouldn't have occurred.

The difference is that the gun is just a tool for the criminal to carryout whatever attack or crime they want. The intent and desire of the criminal remains with or without the gun. Utilizing different means, would intent still meet execution of the crime without the gun? Maybe, maybe not.

In absence of the illegal alien being in our country, the person responsible wouldn't be here and therefore it would be impossible for the accident or crime or whatever to occur.




jkeller - 2/6/2018 at 02:49 AM

quote:
Crimes involving illegal aliens seem to get alot of attention, by those who want to give them attention, because the argument is that if that person wasn't here in the first place, whatever crime or event wouldn't have happened.

The other side of the coin is that any gun related attack or crime, the argument could be if the gun wasn't legal, easily obtained or didn't exist at all then that crime or event wouldn't have occurred.

The difference is that the gun is just a tool for the criminal to carryout whatever attack or crime they want. The intent and desire of the criminal remains with or without the gun. Utilizing different means, would intent still meet execution of the crime without the gun? Maybe, maybe not.

In absence of the illegal alien being in our country, the person responsible wouldn't be here and therefore it would be impossible for the accident or crime or whatever to occur.






Thank you, Capt. Obvious.


2112 - 2/6/2018 at 03:19 AM

quote:
Crimes involving illegal aliens seem to get alot of attention, by those who want to give them attention, because the argument is that if that person wasn't here in the first place, whatever crime or event wouldn't have happened.

The other side of the coin is that any gun related attack or crime, the argument could be if the gun wasn't legal, easily obtained or didn't exist at all then that crime or event wouldn't have occurred.

The difference is that the gun is just a tool for the criminal to carryout whatever attack or crime they want. The intent and desire of the criminal remains with or without the gun. Utilizing different means, would intent still meet execution of the crime without the gun? Maybe, maybe not.

In absence of the illegal alien being in our country, the person responsible wouldn't be here and therefore it would be impossible for the accident or crime or whatever to occur.



Yeah, but this guy has already been deported twice. Do you honestly think for a second that a wall would stop him?


nebish - 2/6/2018 at 03:38 AM

quote:
quote:
Crimes involving illegal aliens seem to get alot of attention, by those who want to give them attention, because the argument is that if that person wasn't here in the first place, whatever crime or event wouldn't have happened.

The other side of the coin is that any gun related attack or crime, the argument could be if the gun wasn't legal, easily obtained or didn't exist at all then that crime or event wouldn't have occurred.

The difference is that the gun is just a tool for the criminal to carryout whatever attack or crime they want. The intent and desire of the criminal remains with or without the gun. Utilizing different means, would intent still meet execution of the crime without the gun? Maybe, maybe not.

In absence of the illegal alien being in our country, the person responsible wouldn't be here and therefore it would be impossible for the accident or crime or whatever to occur.



Yeah, but this guy has already been deported twice. Do you honestly think for a second that a wall would stop him?


Yeah, you're right, we shouldn't try to keep them out. Maybe we should just give illegals driver's licenses instead so they are safer drivers.


2112 - 2/6/2018 at 04:06 AM

quote:
quote:
quote:
Crimes involving illegal aliens seem to get alot of attention, by those who want to give them attention, because the argument is that if that person wasn't here in the first place, whatever crime or event wouldn't have happened.

The other side of the coin is that any gun related attack or crime, the argument could be if the gun wasn't legal, easily obtained or didn't exist at all then that crime or event wouldn't have occurred.

The difference is that the gun is just a tool for the criminal to carryout whatever attack or crime they want. The intent and desire of the criminal remains with or without the gun. Utilizing different means, would intent still meet execution of the crime without the gun? Maybe, maybe not.

In absence of the illegal alien being in our country, the person responsible wouldn't be here and therefore it would be impossible for the accident or crime or whatever to occur.



Yeah, but this guy has already been deported twice. Do you honestly think for a second that a wall would stop him?


Yeah, you're right, we shouldn't try to keep them out. Maybe we should just give illegals driver's licenses instead so they are safer drivers.


That's not what I'm saying at all. But this wasn't a Dreamer and it's not the kind of illegal immigrant that most Democrats are trying to protect. If somebody wants to come here badly enough, they will find away. As much money as the US has spent in keeping drugs from being imported into this country, I don't think we've even slowed it down. The only thing that will keep them out is for their home countries to become safer and offer job opportunities and for the US to no longer offer job opportunities. Come down on employers hiring these illegals hard enough, including jail time, then the demand goes away and there is no incentive to come here. For someone who has traveled all the way across Mexico twice to get to the US, I doubt he won't have trouble finding someplace near the border to buy a ladder.


BIGV - 2/6/2018 at 06:54 AM

quote:
Yeah, but this guy has already been deported twice.


Please address this point. Meaning for the third time we know of he has chosen to do and act as he pleases, this time resulting in a loss of life.

quote:
Do you honestly think for a second that a wall would stop him?


Can we apply this same argument in principle to the deranged shooter with an automatic weapon?
"Do you honestly think for a second that more laws will stop him"?

What a dilemma, If you argue for more gun laws as an attempt to limit access; are you not arguing for a wall?


2112 - 2/6/2018 at 08:31 AM

quote:
quote:
Yeah, but this guy has already been deported twice.


Please address this point. Meaning for the third time we know of he has chosen to do and act as he pleases, this time resulting in a loss of life.

quote:
Do you honestly think for a second that a wall would stop him?


Can we apply this same argument in principle to the deranged shooter with an automatic weapon?
"Do you honestly think for a second that more laws will stop him"?

What a dilemma, If you argue for more gun laws as an attempt to limit access; are you not arguing for a wall?


Now that depends on the gun law. People obtain illegal guns all the time, but people are also caught doing so. If a new law is passed restricting certain guns or ammo, it would take a while to see any affect, as there is already a ton out there. But as time goes by and people decide they want a restricted gun or more ammo, it gives law enforcement an opportunity to cetch people, especially somebody who they may be particularly worried about that they might be monitoring (a suspected terrorist for example).

Now, a wall at the border is really not going to be much of a barrier. It will stop nobody from trying to cross (ladders are cheap and it would be a matter of days before tunnels under the wall will look like a prairie dog town). Will the border control stop more illegals with a wall? Well, that's debatable. Maybe yes, but since most illegals arrive by plane on a tourist visa and just don't leave, is this really money well spent?


alanwoods - 2/6/2018 at 02:10 PM

quote:
quote:
Crimes involving illegal aliens seem to get alot of attention, by those who want to give them attention, because the argument is that if that person wasn't here in the first place, whatever crime or event wouldn't have happened.

The other side of the coin is that any gun related attack or crime, the argument could be if the gun wasn't legal, easily obtained or didn't exist at all then that crime or event wouldn't have occurred.

The difference is that the gun is just a tool for the criminal to carryout whatever attack or crime they want. The intent and desire of the criminal remains with or without the gun. Utilizing different means, would intent still meet execution of the crime without the gun? Maybe, maybe not.

In absence of the illegal alien being in our country, the person responsible wouldn't be here and therefore it would be impossible for the accident or crime or whatever to occur.






Thank you, Capt. Obvious.


Once an Otie...


nebish - 2/6/2018 at 04:36 PM

quote:
That's not what I'm saying at all. But this wasn't a Dreamer and it's not the kind of illegal immigrant that most Democrats are trying to protect. If somebody wants to come here badly enough, they will find away. As much money as the US has spent in keeping drugs from being imported into this country, I don't think we've even slowed it down. The only thing that will keep them out is for their home countries to become safer and offer job opportunities and for the US to no longer offer job opportunities. Come down on employers hiring these illegals hard enough, including jail time, then the demand goes away and there is no incentive to come here. For someone who has traveled all the way across Mexico twice to get to the US, I doubt he won't have trouble finding someplace near the border to buy a ladder.


Where there is a will there is a way.

However, that doesn't mean that the US shouldn't take further steps to make it more difficult on illegal crossings, slow them down, and ideally, make it more likely they get appended at or near the border. Maybe they should electrify the fence, might deter the use of ladders that everyone likes to throw out there. If they build a double layer fence like the secure fence at stated, combined with monitoring assets, once the illegal hits the first layer and tries to scale it, and then they get over it, they now try to scale the second layer, hopefully that buys time for the border security patrol to be alerted to the activity and can dispatch to the area to append and detain. Will they resort to tunnels? Good, that makes it harder on them. Tunnels can be detected with radar and when found must be destroyed. Or if the wall has a funneling effect where more illegals are likely to cross, then resources can focus on those areas. The more hoops illegals have to navigate should play into the goal of appending more.

It does raise one question for me, and I don't know the numbers. But how many illegals who have been deported prior have reentered and been recaptured again? And I wonder what other means of punishment can or should be used for someone who has been caught here illegally before?

Really, this accident is very tragic and unfortunate. To me, however, it doesn't lower my appetite to potentially make a deal for a path to legal status for some number of illegals in this country who have been productive law abiding people while being here. Manuel Orrego-Savala would never have been among those qualifying anyway with multiple deportations. If you get deported and come back illegally again, automatic ineligible for any kind of legal status in a immigration reform law. The law must be coupled with stronger tools for border security and absolutely 100% strict punishment for employers. Mandate the use of e-verify for all employers so they understand and know they must check all employees with the federal background system. At that point we can implement mandatory jail time for employers who hire anyone not cleared by the verify system. Or maybe the fine could be such that it requires the liquidation of the business to pay the fine - essentially putting that company out of business permanently. They will get the message, hiring illegal labor will not be tolerated.


gina - 2/6/2018 at 07:09 PM

quote:
quote:
Crimes involving illegal aliens seem to get alot of attention, by those who want to give them attention, because the argument is that if that person wasn't here in the first place, whatever crime or event wouldn't have happened.

The other side of the coin is that any gun related attack or crime, the argument could be if the gun wasn't legal, easily obtained or didn't exist at all then that crime or event wouldn't have occurred.

The difference is that the gun is just a tool for the criminal to carryout whatever attack or crime they want. The intent and desire of the criminal remains with or without the gun. Utilizing different means, would intent still meet execution of the crime without the gun? Maybe, maybe not.

In absence of the illegal alien being in our country, the person responsible wouldn't be here and therefore it would be impossible for the accident or crime or whatever to occur.



Yeah, but this guy has already been deported twice. Do you honestly think for a second that a wall would stop him?


Possibly not, but it would deter some people from coming in. The problem when these crimes happen with someone who is illegal is that we do not immediately deport them, we spend time and taxpayer dollars giving the person free legal counsel. There should be two choices in manslaughter/murder, either kill them outright or deport them, in this case, since he came in a second time and killed someone, he should just be killed. Never mind three strikes your're out.

Amnesty one time, deport them the first time, second time, execute him IF he is caught here killing someone.

Otherwise if you just keep finding someone coming back, deport him as many times as necessary. No courts, no nonsense.



[Edited on 2/6/2018 by gina]


BoytonBrother - 2/9/2018 at 03:49 PM

This is not an immigration issue. This is a criminal DUI tragedy, nothing more. Take your smokescreen act and go back to your holes. Illegal immigration will be an issue forever, with or without Trump. If you are this unhinged about it, go seek therapy.


crazyjoe - 2/9/2018 at 06:05 PM

quote:
So we send them back and they return again and again thru our porous southern border. Failed immigration policy causes another tragedy. Not only does he cause a serious crash, he flees the scene. Tell me again how they respect the rule of law please?

https://www.indystar.com/story/news/crime/2018/02/05/driver-accused-killing -colts-player-edwin-jackson-undocumented-immigrant-has-been-deported-twice/ 306779002/

BTW, nice crew-cab F150 truck for an illegal. Kind of goes against the poor produce- picking picture painted by Pelosi.





Well, I thought one less ungrateful, flag disrespecting, NFL player would be a good thing for You Guys?........Peace.......joe


BoytonBrother - 2/9/2018 at 06:50 PM

quote:
Tell me again how they respect the rule of law please?


Nothing funnier than Goober pretending to care about our laws, lol. Such a patriot he is! Is that Captain America in the forum?





[Edited on 2/9/2018 by BoytonBrother]


BIGV - 2/9/2018 at 07:27 PM

quote:
quote:
Tell me again how they respect the rule of law please?


Nothing funnier than Goober pretending to care about our laws, lol. Such a patriot he is! Is that Captain America in the forum?


You could answer his question.



BoytonBrother - 2/9/2018 at 07:38 PM

quote:
You could answer his question.


If I thought it was relevant, I would. Discussing whether or not it is disrespectful to American law, is as pointless as discussing whether smoking pot at a concert is disrespectful to American law. I find both to be silly. Just get over it already.


BrerRabbit - 2/9/2018 at 08:15 PM

Actually in most of the US smoking pot at a concert is a far more serious crime than illegal border crossing.


BIGV - 2/9/2018 at 09:39 PM

quote:
quote:
You could answer his question.


If I thought it was relevant, I would.


There you have it.


jkeller - 2/9/2018 at 10:47 PM

quote:
quote:
quote:
You could answer his question.


If I thought it was relevant, I would.


There you have it.


No, there you have part of it. The rest of his post told the story. Nice cherry picking. You excel at that.


BoytonBrother - 2/9/2018 at 10:59 PM

He's not interested in discussing the latter part of my post because he's only here to state that he hates an entire political party, like a true model citizen.


BIGV - 2/10/2018 at 01:01 AM

quote:
discussing whether smoking pot at a concert is disrespectful to American law.


Now that would depend on the State. "Disrespect" in quite a few States might be ...harsh, meaning you would have a decision to make. "Is it worth the risk" ? "Am I willing to pay the price if apprehended"?


BoytonBrother - 2/10/2018 at 01:32 AM

quote:
"Disrespect" in quite a few States might be ...harsh, meaning you would have a decision to make. "Is it worth the risk" ? "Am I willing to pay the price if apprehended"?


And if that person says that it is worth the risk and the penalty, then it's not disrespectful to the law? That the term "disrespectful" is too harsh to describe that person? Do I have that correct?


BIGV - 2/10/2018 at 01:55 PM

quote:
quote:
"Disrespect" in quite a few States might be ...harsh, meaning you would have a decision to make. "Is it worth the risk" ? "Am I willing to pay the price if apprehended"?


And if that person says that it is worth the risk and the penalty, then it's not disrespectful to the law? That the term "disrespectful" is too harsh to describe that person? Do I have that correct?


"Disrespect for the Law". It is about personal responsibility. Every action in life has a consequence, we all have the power of choice.

quote:
This is not an immigration issue. This is a criminal DUI tragedy, nothing more


I would argue that this is exactly what it is. One choice led to another, he chose to enter the USA Illegally, chose to drive under the influence and then left the scene of the crime.

If he had not entered Illegally, would not Mr. Edwin Jackson, still be alive?


crazyjoe - 2/10/2018 at 05:16 PM

quote:
quote:
quote:
"Disrespect" in quite a few States might be ...harsh, meaning you would have a decision to make. "Is it worth the risk" ? "Am I willing to pay the price if apprehended"?


And if that person says that it is worth the risk and the penalty, then it's not disrespectful to the law? That the term "disrespectful" is too harsh to describe that person? Do I have that correct?


"Disrespect for the Law". It is about personal responsibility. Every action in life has a consequence, we all have the power of choice.

quote:
This is not an immigration issue. This is a criminal DUI tragedy, nothing more


I would argue that this is exactly what it is. One choice led to another, he chose to enter the USA Illegally, chose to drive under the influence and then left the scene of the crime.

If he had not entered Illegally, would not Mr. Edwin Jackson, still be alive?


Well to me, "Laws" are of limited value, and I pay only casual attention to them and I have tried to instill some of this self reflection in my kids.Just wonder how many serial killers, have decided not to do it because it was against the law, how many would be muggers decided not to smash someone over the head because it's against the law? How many pimps have been dissuaded from their activities because they are against the law? My guess not many. To me, one needs to have a damn solid understanding of what is right and wrong, embedded in their Hearts and Souls, for one to sit back and rely on some person, most likely no more moral than ones self, to tell You right from wrong, is riduculous. I have certainly not always done right thing and have done somethings I wish I would have done differently, however, at the time I was doing them I was well aware they were wrong, but I chose to do them anyway. No "law" was going to change my mind. The most important "Laws" to me are in the Soul? I've never been arrested or spent a night in jail. Tough for me to buy into what some morally bankrupt, powerful person is telling me I should be doing, i.e. the Trump family, Sessions, Pence, Nunes etc, etc............Peace........joe


Muleman1994 - 2/10/2018 at 05:24 PM

quote:
quote:
quote:
"Disrespect" in quite a few States might be ...harsh, meaning you would have a decision to make. "Is it worth the risk" ? "Am I willing to pay the price if apprehended"?


And if that person says that it is worth the risk and the penalty, then it's not disrespectful to the law? That the term "disrespectful" is too harsh to describe that person? Do I have that correct?


"Disrespect for the Law". It is about personal responsibility. Every action in life has a consequence, we all have the power of choice.

quote:
This is not an immigration issue. This is a criminal DUI tragedy, nothing more


I would argue that this is exactly what it is. One choice led to another, he chose to enter the USA Illegally, chose to drive under the influence and then left the scene of the crime.

If he had not entered Illegally, would not Mr. Edwin Jackson, still be alive?



Thanks to Obama's disregard for the law, Edwin Jackson is dead like so many other American Citizens killed by repeatedly deported criminal illegal aliens.



crazyjoe - 2/10/2018 at 05:34 PM

quote:
quote:
quote:
quote:
"Disrespect" in quite a few States might be ...harsh, meaning you would have a decision to make. "Is it worth the risk" ? "Am I willing to pay the price if apprehended"?


And if that person says that it is worth the risk and the penalty, then it's not disrespectful to the law? That the term "disrespectful" is too harsh to describe that person? Do I have that correct?


"Disrespect for the Law". It is about personal responsibility. Every action in life has a consequence, we all have the power of choice.

quote:
This is not an immigration issue. This is a criminal DUI tragedy, nothing more


I would argue that this is exactly what it is. One choice led to another, he chose to enter the USA Illegally, chose to drive under the influence and then left the scene of the crime.

If he had not entered Illegally, would not Mr. Edwin Jackson, still be alive?



Thanks to Obama's disregard for the law, Edwin Jackson is dead like so many other American Citizens killed by repeatedly deported criminal illegal aliens.





As i said above, i am not overly impressed by or obsessed with "laws", just wondering how many folks are killed each year by drunken off duty cops on the road, how many innocent men and women have been beat to death or half to death in bars by drunken off duty cops? Growing up in Chicago and now living nearby, I am aware of a good amount of this behaviour, I would guess while definitely not huge, the number would be fairly significant? .........Peace.......joe

[Edited on 2/10/2018 by crazyjoe]


BoytonBrother - 2/10/2018 at 05:37 PM

quote:
"Disrespect for the Law". It is about personal responsibility. Every action in life has a consequence, we all have the power of choice.


As in your choice to evade the question of whether you find it disrespectful to American law if someone were to smoke a joint at a concert.

quote:
I would argue that this is exactly what it is. One choice led to another, he chose to enter the USA Illegally, chose to drive under the influence and then left the scene of the crime.


Yes. Point? Both individuals, the illegal and the pot smoker, both made their choices. Correct.

quote:
If he had not entered Illegally, would not Mr. Edwin Jackson, still be alive?


A legal expert BIGV is not, lol. Thank god for judges.







[Edited on 2/11/2018 by BoytonBrother]


Muleman1994 - 2/10/2018 at 09:51 PM

quote:
quote:
quote:
quote:
quote:
"Disrespect" in quite a few States might be ...harsh, meaning you would have a decision to make. "Is it worth the risk" ? "Am I willing to pay the price if apprehended"?


And if that person says that it is worth the risk and the penalty, then it's not disrespectful to the law? That the term "disrespectful" is too harsh to describe that person? Do I have that correct?


"Disrespect for the Law". It is about personal responsibility. Every action in life has a consequence, we all have the power of choice.

quote:
This is not an immigration issue. This is a criminal DUI tragedy, nothing more


I would argue that this is exactly what it is. One choice led to another, he chose to enter the USA Illegally, chose to drive under the influence and then left the scene of the crime.

If he had not entered Illegally, would not Mr. Edwin Jackson, still be alive?



Thanks to Obama's disregard for the law, Edwin Jackson is dead like so many other American Citizens killed by repeatedly deported criminal illegal aliens.





As i said above, i am not overly impressed by or obsessed with "laws", just wondering how many folks are killed each year by drunken off duty cops on the road, how many innocent men and women have been beat to death or half to death in bars by drunken off duty cops? Growing up in Chicago and now living nearby, I am aware of a good amount of this behaviour, I would guess while definitely not huge, the number would be fairly significant? .........Peace.......joe

[Edited on 2/10/2018 by crazyjoe]



Okay junior, post the number and a legitimate source for your dodge.

Put up or shut up.


crazyjoe - 2/10/2018 at 10:40 PM

https://news.vice.com/en_us/article/595kv3/police-crime-database

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.washingtonpost.com/amphtml/news/true-crime /wp/2016/06/22/study-finds-1100-police-officers-per-year-or-3-per-day-are-a rrested-nationwide/


https://massappeal.com/cops-crime-database-america/

There is a government file which can be downloaded which also details officers involved in the commission of crimes, couldn't figure out how to share it, there You go Mule, now You can get back to worshipping Your big orange buddha.........Peace........joe


goldtop - 2/11/2018 at 03:59 AM

What is the statistic of Americans that kill other Americans everyday. 2 Police officers killed today by an American citizen....Shooting everyday...kids killing each other in school shooting and we're talking about 1 drunk driving incident. I wonder how many Americans died yesterday in drunk driving accidents caused by other Americans

I wish all the Trump/Tucker Carlson/ Sean Hannity crowd would just Grow the Phuck Up


crazyjoe - 2/11/2018 at 07:00 AM

quote:
What is the statistic of Americans that kill other Americans everyday. 2 Police officers killed today by an American citizen....Shooting everyday...kids killing each other in school shooting and we're talking about 1 drunk driving incident. I wonder how many Americans died yesterday in drunk driving accidents caused by other Americans

I wish all the Trump/Tucker Carlson/ Sean Hannity crowd would just Grow the Phuck Up




Well, for me goldtop, Your point is well taken and even though I knew I was drifting into assanine, bickering territory, I didn't care since none of these threads are on topic anymore.
Look, You are correct here, i live right between Chicago and South Bend, throw in the Hoosier Hick factor and the industrial blighted areas like Gary. If You watch the local news or read a paper, or raise 4 kids as i did and You will see it all, all of what You mentioned and plenty more, serious things, a lot of it on personal and local level. Pretty silly to be bickering like a Ninny? Not to say I ain't gonna do it again!!! Besides, some of these other guys are much bigger Ninnies than I am.........Peace......joe

[Edited on 2/11/2018 by crazyjoe]


goldtop - 2/11/2018 at 04:29 PM

Here's a story today out of Kentucky 5 killed...Americans killing Americans....where will we deport them to?? Oh how about we send them to Trumpistan....Oh yeah they all ready live there

Five people, including a suspect, are dead after a string of killings Saturday in northeast Kentucky, authorities said.

Deputies in Johnson County, Ky., found two bodies in a home, then in the search for the suspect, Joseph Nickell, two additional people were found dead. Deputies say Nickell committed suicide.

"This has been a horrific murder spree," said Johnson County Sheriff Dwayne Price. "There are no words to describe the heartbreak in seeing four lives taken due to the actions of one man. I have worked in law enforcement for 34 years. This is one of the most disturbing acts of violence I have ever seen."

Deputies got a call about 3:30 p.m. about a shooting in a rural home near the city of Paintsville, Ky. After responding, they found two people who had been shot and killed in the kitchen, according to the Johnson County Sheriff's Office.

More: Teen suspect remains in custody in New Year's Eve shooting; gag order issued

More: Prosecutor delays decision on whether to try 16-year-old accused in mass killing as adult

A witness identified the suspect as Nickell and gave a description of the car he fled in, deputies said.

Authorities throughout the area were on alert and cautioned that Nickell was armed and dangerous.

A 911 call about the car led deputies to a second home in Paintsville where they found two other people dead in an apartment. Nickell also was found dead as a result of suicide, Price said.

If you listen to FOX News/ Breibart/info wars/Rush limp-pud/tucker carlson/sean hannity or Little Donny Dictator
Grow the phuck up


BIGV - 2/11/2018 at 05:26 PM

quote:
Here's a story today out of Kentucky 5 killed...Americans killing Americans....where will we deport them to??


Let's deport them to Prison, we can do that to citizens.


StratDal - 2/12/2018 at 02:59 PM

Sadly, innocent citizens in our country can suffer terribly from those of all walks of life in our country.

https://www.cnn.com/2018/02/12/us/gun-background-check-backlog-military-dis honorable-discharge-invs/index.html


BrerRabbit - 2/12/2018 at 05:35 PM

Guns don't kill people, guitars kill people:


2112 - 2/12/2018 at 09:19 PM

The one thing this thread has completely ignored is that although there have been a few crimes committed by illegal aliens that have taken the lives of American citizens, there are more instances where illegal aliens have saved the lives of American citizens.


Immigrant Heroes Save American Lives

Jeff Jacoby  | March 08, 2017

 
LIZZIE BORDEN, who was unsuccessfully prosecuted in 1892 for the axe murders of her father and stepmother, had red hair. So did Lynette Fromme, who spent 34 years in prison for attempting to assassinate President Gerald Ford. Vladimir Lenin, the Bolshevik revolutionary who became one of history's bloodiest mass murderers, was also a redhead. Ditto the Wild West gangster and bank robber, Jesse James.

As those examples demonstrate, people with red hair are prone to violence and should be suppressed. Right?

Of course not.

Only a blockhead would pronounce redheads a singular threat on the strength of a few cherry-picked instances of villains with red hair. Pretty much any population subgroup will contain some number of vicious thugs. You can find "bad hombres" — to coin a phrase — among tall people or French speakers or tea drinkers or Methodists. So what? A handful of offenders within a group doesn't mean the group as a whole is more likely to offend.

The same is true of undocumented immigrants.

That should be self-evident. Yet among immigration restrictionists and seal-the-border hardliners, it has become an article of faith that anyone who enters the country without a lawful visa is a "criminal alien" and a danger to public safety.

As a matter of straight fact, that belief is false. Decades of research confirm that immigrants to the United States are significantly less likely than native-born citizens to commit serious crimes or be in prison. It makes no difference whether immigrants enter the country with or without legal documents: Scores of peer-reviewed studies establish a negative correlation between immigration and crime. Just last week, Governing magazine reported that in the 20 US metro areas with the greatest presence of illegal immigrants, average rates of violent crime and property crime are 8 percent to 10 percent lower than the national average. During the 1990s and 2000s, as the number of illegal immigrants in the United States tripled to nearly 12 million, crime rates nationwide plunged more than 40 percent.

Donald Trump may be sincere when he insists that immigrants, especially unauthorized immigrants, are a threat to public safety. But he's wrong. Immigration doesn't increase crime, it reduces it.

Obviously there have been some brutal exceptions to the rule, and Trump has repeatedly made a point of highlighting Americans whose loved ones were killed by illegal immigrants. Four such Americans were in the visitors' gallery during Trump's Feb. 28 speech to Congress. He used their devastating stories to lend emotional support to his harsh immigration stance, and announced the creation of a new federal program — Victims of Immigration Crime Engagement, or VOICE — specifically to publicize crimes committed by migrants from other countries.

Singling out assaults committed by the foreign-born might be defensible if immigrants were predisposed to crime. But immigrants are unusually law-abiding. Harping on a few atypical examples amounts to raw demagoguery — the scapegoating of a stigmatized group to incite fear and hatred.

Instead of beating the bushes for bad immigrants to demonize, federal officials should be drawing attention to immigrants who demonstrate extraordinary heroism.

Immigrants like William Ramirez, for example, a father of two from Colombia, who was on his way to his maintenance job at a boatyard when he witnessed a man trying to gun down a Miami police officer. Ramirez drove his van into the line of fire, shielding the policeman from the shooter and pulling him to safety.

Immigrants like Diaz Chacon, an illegal Mexican immigrant in Albuquerque, who saw a young girl being abducted off the street, and unhesitatingly raced after the kidnapper to rescue the child.

Immigrants like Jesus Manuel Cordova, who saved the life of a 9-year-old boy stranded in the Arizona desert. The boy's mother had died in a crash, leaving him helpless — until he was discovered by Cordova, who had just entered the country illegally. Cordova stayed with the boy, keeping watch for hours until someone eventually found them and contacted the authorities.

Far from degrading America through crime and violence, immigrants enhance our nation's safety and security. There are a few shockingly bad apples, yes. Vastly more common are the heroes and hard workers who love this country and prove it daily. Diligent, peaceable, grateful, they enrich their communities in ways large and small, and, in so doing, continuously make America great again.


Muleman1994 - 2/12/2018 at 09:53 PM

No one has a problem with immigrants.
We The People have a problem with illegal immigration.

No, the illegals are not the "backbone of America" and all the other crap the left spouses.

The illegals take from the working American people.




BoytonBrother - 2/12/2018 at 10:58 PM

That’s right! Mule has a problem with illegals who disrespect our laws...whether it’s an illegal immigrant crossing the border or criminals who use drugs at concerts. A criminal is a criminal, period! All you pot smokers who have the nerve to disrespect our flag by lighting up.....in public no less! Thank you to Mule for pointing out that it’s the disrespect of law that’s the issue - not immigrants themselves. Are you paying taxes on that pot? Who has to pay for your jail time and court costs? Not to mention the burden you place on law enforcement. Incarcerate all illegal immigrants and illegal citizens!!!


OriginalGoober - 2/13/2018 at 01:35 AM

Illegals over Americans .it's your problem if you question the left on this reasoning.


nebish - 2/13/2018 at 05:27 AM

quote:
The one thing this thread has completely ignored is that although there have been a few crimes committed by illegal aliens that have taken the lives of American citizens, there are more instances where illegal aliens have saved the lives of American citizens.


That is a good counter-point about news worthy legal or illegal immigrants doing the right thing in certain situations they find themselves in. I'd be happy if more of those stories made the headlines.

I don't agree with the overall sentiment of the article though.

quote:
Far from degrading America through crime and violence, immigrants enhance our nation's safety and security. There are a few shockingly bad apples, yes. Vastly more common are the heroes and hard workers who love this country and prove it daily. Diligent, peaceable, grateful, they enrich their communities in ways large and small, and, in so doing, continuously make America great again.


Immigrants are important for our country, obviously. They always have been and always will be. Note, I think it is important to differentiate legal immigrants from illegal immigrants. Surely there are heros and hard workers that love this country among legal immigrants,. But illegal immigrants do not belong here, and they take jobs they are not entitled too....roofing, drywall, not every job an illegal immigrant gets is a job an American doesn't want to do. Illegals take away resources that could otherwise go to citizens and legal status immigrants.

I do think there are some changes we could enact to make our legal immigration system better, both for those who want to come here to contribute and for our country and employers. I would rather put the negative focus on the battle vs illegal immigration because I don't want to unfairly lump people who follow the legal immigration system with those who choose to overstay their visa or enter illegally. They have no right to be here, we are under no obligation to let them stay here. They should be subject to detention and removal, every time. We should make it harder for these people to come and stay and live here.

As to illegals killing citizens, there may've been a 'few' that are nationally reported, but not every one makes national headlines. Some do, some don't. Here are a 'few' stories from just this past year, some you may know about, others you may not. Undoubtely if we opened up the range of say 10 years or whatever that 'few' unfortunate deaths of US citizens at the hands of illegals would balloon to 'several' dozen.

Cop killer -
http://www.sacbee.com/news/local/article199426929.html

This one is a real beauty, Dreamer kills father of two who came to help a victim.
http://abc13.com/suspect-in-fatal-store-shooting-in-us-under-daca-program/3 060796/

Here is the murder of the girls high lighted in the State of the Union Speech. 13 MS13 members arrested, 10 are illegal, 2 have green cards and 1 is a citizen
https://www.cbsnews.com/news/report-ms-13-gang-members-arrested-in-slayings -of-ny-teen-girls/

Illegal Eustacio Gregorio-Meza fled after killing Florida man on motorcycle
http://www.palmbeachpost.com/news/crime--law/just-driver-with-license-held- following-fatal-motorcycle-crash/1vWwGf9RxsI2Ga9XqjtkoL/

Another Illegal, Victor Villanueva Rivera, also fled after striking and killing Florida man on motorcycle
http://www.palmbeachpost.com/news/crime--law/new-immigrant-feared-deportati on-didn-stop-following-fatal-wreck/zt6PNo0eCXdnxq8iqmul8O

Illegal charged with vehicular homicide
http://www.wtol.com/story/34998656/crash-leaves-three-dead-in-jerusalem-twp -one-week-after-different-deadly-crash

There are others. The immigration status is not always immediately known and it seems like alot of these stories don't receive attention.

I will say that alot of people on the right jump to conclusions and try to blow the number out of proportion. And then those on the left try to minimize it. I just say illegal immigrants should not be here and the crimes they are charged with should've never happened.


BIGV - 2/13/2018 at 06:01 AM

quote:
That’s right! Mule has a problem with illegals who disrespect our laws...whether it’s an illegal immigrant crossing the border or criminals who use drugs at concerts. A criminal is a criminal, period! All you pot smokers who have the nerve to disrespect our flag by lighting up.....in public no less! Thank you to Mule for pointing out that it’s the disrespect of law that’s the issue - not immigrants themselves. Are you paying taxes on that pot? Who has to pay for your jail time and court costs? Not to mention the burden you place on law enforcement. Incarcerate all illegal immigrants and illegal citizens!!!


Are you equating the smoking of marijuana by a citizen to evading the Border Patrol and entering the USA Illegally?

Pretty weak.


BrerRabbit - 2/13/2018 at 03:23 PM

Marijuana possession and illegal border crossing are both violations of US federal law.

Illegal border crossing is a misdemeanor under federal law, punishable by a fine, or up to 6 months, Overstaying a visa is a civil infraction, and handled by immigration court.

Possession of a Schedule 1 controlled substance like marijuana is also a misdemeanor on first offense under federal law, fine or up to a year, twice the penalty of illegal border entry. Repeat drug offenses carry even harsher penalties that would never be levied on repeated border crossing offenses.

Under US law, marijuana use is much worse than border crossing.


BIGV - 2/13/2018 at 03:54 PM

quote:
Under US law, marijuana use is much worse than border crossing.


Anyone else see a problem here?


nebish - 2/13/2018 at 04:29 PM

Yes, BigV and good points BrerRabbit.

Can somebody answer why the Obama administration didn't reclassify marijuana when they had the chance?

At any rate, illegally entering our country or overstaying a visa should carry a stiffer penalty than being caught with a small amount of weed.


BoytonBrother - 2/13/2018 at 04:38 PM

quote:
Are you equating the smoking of marijuana by a citizen to evading the Border Patrol and entering the USA Illegally?

Pretty weak.


Equating? No. Just pointing out that both are disrespectful to the flag and to our law enforcement. Pretty weak? As soon as someone disagrees with you, you insult. Isn’t that your mantra? Doesn’t that make you a liberal? Oh well.







[Edited on 2/13/2018 by BoytonBrother]


BoytonBrother - 2/13/2018 at 04:41 PM

quote:
Anyone else see a problem here?


Money talks the loudest. I’m assuming one is a larger financial burden than the other.


Muleman1994 - 2/13/2018 at 05:06 PM

quote:
Illegals over Americans .it's your problem if you question the left on this reasoning.


Boyton, having difficulty staying on topic diverts to a completely unrelated issue: weed. That is the Obama tactic of "but look at the shiny object over there" when he didn't want to answer a question.

Of course it was Obama that told ICE and the Border Patrol to stand down and allow the repeatedly deported criminal illegal aliens to come back on in and kill more Americans.




BIGV - 2/13/2018 at 05:15 PM

quote:
quote:
Are you equating the smoking of marijuana by a citizen to evading the Border Patrol and entering the USA Illegally?

Pretty weak.


Equating? No. Just pointing out that both are disrespectful to the flag and to our law enforcement. Pretty weak? As soon as someone disagrees with you, you insult. Isn’t that your mantra? Doesn’t that make you a liberal? Oh well.


"Pretty weak" is an insult?

Hahahaha


MartinD28 - 2/13/2018 at 05:42 PM

quote:

Can somebody answer why the Obama administration didn't reclassify marijuana when they had the chance?



He left it to Jeff Sessions, a big friend & advocate for marijuana.


BrerRabbit - 2/13/2018 at 05:45 PM

quote:
Can somebody answer why the Obama administration didn't reclassify marijuana when they had the chance?


Easy one- because he was a hogtied chickensh*t corporate Monsanto whore.


BoytonBrother - 2/13/2018 at 06:12 PM

quote:
"Pretty weak" is an insult?


I know you are a big tough guy and all, and don’t care what other people think, but If someone said your hobby of stalking celebrities to get autographs like an 8-year old was weak for a grown man, would you categorize that an insult, even if it doesn’t bother you? Ah, who cares.





[Edited on 2/13/2018 by BoytonBrother]


BIGV - 2/13/2018 at 11:15 PM

quote:
would you categorize that an insult, even if it doesn’t bother you? Ah, who cares.


Nah Man, I do this little thing called "Consider the source"...and move on.


BoytonBrother - 2/13/2018 at 11:47 PM

Good! Then hopefully I won’t see you constantly responding to my posts.


Muleman1994 - 2/14/2018 at 03:13 AM

'Grossly impaired' illegal immigrant blamed for crash that killed toddler
By Robert Gearty | Fox News

Illegal immigrant Jose Romero, 27, is accused of slamming into an ambulance that overturned after being struck, killing a 3-year-old boy early Sunday in Winston-Salem, N.C. (Winston-Salem Police Department)

An unlicensed illegal immigrant was “grossly impaired” when he crashed into an ambulance and killed a 3-year-old boy, court papers say.

The boy, from Wise, Va., died Monday, a day after the crash. He was with his mother in the ambulance when it was struck and rolled over in Winston-Salem, N.C. Lyndsay Ann Oakes, 27, suffered minor injuries. The boy was not identified.

Jose Duran Romero, 27, blew a 0.19 on a breathalyzer nearly two hours after the crash, more than twice the legal limit, FOX8 Winston-Salem reported late Monday.

Court papers say Romero, who was behind the wheel of a Honda Accord even though he had never owned a driver’s license, had “bloodshot, glassy eyes,” slurred his speech and looked “grossly impaired,” according to the station.

Romero was also in the country illegally, the station reported.

Federal authorities lodged an immigration detainer against him after his arrest. They said he was from El Salvador.

The ambulance was taking the boy and his mother to a trauma center.

Gary Oakes said Monday his grandson had been under medical care before the crash but didn't want to elaborate. Asked how the family was coping, Oakes said, "It's devastating."

Lyndsay Ann Oakes asked for privacy on her Facebook page.

Police said the Honda was traveling south on U.S. 52 at around 1 a.m. Sunday when it rammed into the side of the ambulance which was also going south.

The two paramedics in the ambulance were treated for minor injuries, the Winston-Salem Journal reported Tuesday.

A police spokesman told the paper Romero and a passenger in the Accord, Andres Leon, 33, fled after the crash. One was caught right away by a person who saw the crash. The other man was captured by police a short time later.

Romero was charged with driving while intoxicated and driving without a license. He was being held without bail after bail had been set and then revoked.

It was unclear if the charges would be upgraded as a result of the child’s death.

Leon was being held on $1,000 bail after being charged with failure to render aid and to provide information.

The Associated Press contributed to this report.


BIGV - 2/14/2018 at 03:21 AM

quote:
No one has a problem with immigrants.
We The People have a problem with illegal immigration


Exactly.

What do you say to the people standing in line, waiting to enter the Country Legally?


nebish - 2/14/2018 at 04:14 PM

quote:
It's clear that that, to some, your birthplace ultimately determines how obligated one must be to follow the letter of the law.

But no surprise there as today skin color and religion determine both motive and severity of a given crime.


I'd counter, that to some...me, one's legal status in our country determines the attention the incident gets or doesn't. Because again, those people have no right to be here and if they hadn't violated our immigration law in the first place, the crime or accident or what-have-you would never have occurred. All these events are tragic, sad and unfortunate, to me, the fact that the perpetrator was an illegal alien makes it even moreso. It makes no difference where they were born or their skin color or other variables, it makes a difference on their legal status.


BIGV - 2/14/2018 at 04:39 PM

quote:
Because again, those people have no right to be here and if they hadn't violated our immigration law in the first place, the crime or accident or what-have-you would never have occurred.


Absolutely 100% Agreed.

But you are not addressing one's disrespect for the law when you smoke pot.
LOL


BoytonBrother - 2/14/2018 at 05:34 PM



[Edited on 2/14/2018 by BoytonBrother]


BoytonBrother - 2/14/2018 at 05:42 PM

quote:
Because again, those people have no right to be here and if they hadn't violated our immigration law in the first place, the crime or accident or what-have-you would never have occurred.


if he had a temporary 6-month visa, then he wouldn’t have driven drunk that day?



[Edited on 2/14/2018 by BoytonBrother]


nebish - 2/14/2018 at 05:54 PM

Yes and no. I think I would foster more resentment if I was injured or lost a friend or family member at the hands of an illegal alien. I'm not generally the forgiving type, I'm robbed, my love one is killed - I want maximum punishments possible to come down on those people regardless of who they are or where they came from. It would however certainly bother me more if that was an illegal who had no business being here that committed the act. Your mileage, or anyone else's may very.

You say, take that illegal alien and make them a 6 month visa holder, thereby making them legal, and the event may still have happened. Well, maybe that illegal would never have qualified or been granted the visa. Or if so, maybe work placement or employer sponsorship would've put them in a different part of the country. It is like anything else. Change one variable, anything, it changes the whole circumstance and outcome.

What are we doing here, we are looking broadly at thing that happen, or that shouldn't happen. Are there something like 43 murders in the US per day (2015 15,696 / 365), or something like 28 deaths from DUI per day (2015 10,265 / 365). If we aren't directly impacted by those events, what do we do? We generalize, we discuss outside-looking-in, we form opinions, we talk about it with people we know or on an internet forum.

I'll assume or simply concede, that if you broke the numbers down, the overall % of those events occur at a smaller rate at the hands of an illegal immigrant, vs a legal immigrant vs that of a natural US citizen. But crimes and accidents are going to happen here - I accept that as a given. We have people here that want to commit those crimes or put themselves in situations to cause accidents. It is unfortunate, but it happens. What I will not accept having incrementally more of it caused by people who shouldn't be here.


BoytonBrother - 2/14/2018 at 05:59 PM

quote:
You say, take that illegal alien and make them a 6 month visa holder, thereby making them legal, and the event may still have happened. Well, maybe that illegal would never have qualified or been granted the visa. Or if so, maybe work placement or employer sponsorship would've put them in a different part of the country. It is like anything else. Change one variable, anything, it changes the whole circumstance and outcome.


If their status affects how you interpret the crime, no problem. But our courts do not. This is not an immigration story, but I surely understand your position.


pops42 - 2/14/2018 at 07:22 PM

quote:
'Grossly impaired' illegal immigrant blamed for crash that killed toddler
By Robert Gearty | Fox News

Illegal immigrant Jose Romero, 27, is accused of slamming into an ambulance that overturned after being struck, killing a 3-year-old boy early Sunday in Winston-Salem, N.C. (Winston-Salem Police Department)

An unlicensed illegal immigrant was “grossly impaired” when he crashed into an ambulance and killed a 3-year-old boy, court papers say.

The boy, from Wise, Va., died Monday, a day after the crash. He was with his mother in the ambulance when it was struck and rolled over in Winston-Salem, N.C. Lyndsay Ann Oakes, 27, suffered minor injuries. The boy was not identified.

Jose Duran Romero, 27, blew a 0.19 on a breathalyzer nearly two hours after the crash, more than twice the legal limit, FOX8 Winston-Salem reported late Monday.

Court papers say Romero, who was behind the wheel of a Honda Accord even though he had never owned a driver’s license, had “bloodshot, glassy eyes,” slurred his speech and looked “grossly impaired,” according to the station.

Romero was also in the country illegally, the station reported.

Federal authorities lodged an immigration detainer against him after his arrest. They said he was from El Salvador.

The ambulance was taking the boy and his mother to a trauma center.

Gary Oakes said Monday his grandson had been under medical care before the crash but didn't want to elaborate. Asked how the family was coping, Oakes said, "It's devastating."

Lyndsay Ann Oakes asked for privacy on her Facebook page.

Police said the Honda was traveling south on U.S. 52 at around 1 a.m. Sunday when it rammed into the side of the ambulance which was also going south.

The two paramedics in the ambulance were treated for minor injuries, the Winston-Salem Journal reported Tuesday.

A police spokesman told the paper Romero and a passenger in the Accord, Andres Leon, 33, fled after the crash. One was caught right away by a person who saw the crash. The other man was captured by police a short time later.

Romero was charged with driving while intoxicated and driving without a license. He was being held without bail after bail had been set and then revoked.

It was unclear if the charges would be upgraded as a result of the child’s death.

Leon was being held on $1,000 bail after being charged with failure to render aid and to provide information.

The Associated Press contributed to this report.


He was sober, and a legal citizen, and your hero right? https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2017/aug/13/charlottesville-james-field s-charged-with-was-pictured-at-neo-nazi-rally-vanguard-america


BrerRabbit - 2/14/2018 at 09:43 PM

That's different, the left made that guy drive his car into the crowd.


BIGV - 2/15/2018 at 12:02 AM

quote:
You say, take that illegal alien and make them a 6 month visa holder, thereby making them legal, and the event may still have happened.


But it did happen and he was here Illegally... For the third &u$%@%g time

If this does not speak directly to the blatant disrespect for the very first Law of the land he encountered, I do not know what does.

He also attempted to flee the scene. This "event" also resulted in a Death.

Perhaps it is as easy to cross the Border Illegally as it is to acquire a semi-automatic rifle?


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